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-on vs -u

viết bởi deltasalmon, Ngày 06 tháng 1 năm 2015

Tin nhắn: 7

Nội dung: English

deltasalmon (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 14:14:16 Ngày 06 tháng 1 năm 2015

Saluton!

I'm new to this forum and new to Esperanto so sorry if this is an obvious question.

My first Esperanto "study guide" was the phrases on this website: http://omniglot.com/language/phrases/esperanto.php

After reading about grammar I was confused about some of the phrases that end in -on which I thought was the accusative noun ending.

Saluton / Helpon / Dankon.

My guess is that these phrases are abbreviated for longer ones like "Mi bezonas helpon" => "Helpon". Would "helpu" have the same meaning?

robbkvasnak (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 16:02:06 Ngày 06 tháng 1 năm 2015

Both would be correct. "Helpu" is the imperative form of the verb "helpi" and "helpon" is the objective case for the noun "helpo" - in this case short for "Donu al mi helpon!" Language is not nath - it is a reflection of the thinking, creative human brain seeking a meaning for reality in a world that we have not yet fully grasped. That is part of the miracle of our humanity.

Fenris_kcf (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 16:02:24 Ngày 06 tháng 1 năm 2015

That depends on who is the actor and who the receiver of the action, of course. You can not replace "dankon" with "danku" or "saluton" with "salutu".

Mustelvulpo (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 19:26:28 Ngày 08 tháng 1 năm 2015

Helpu is the imperative / volitive form of help used as a verb.

Imperative- Helpu min!- Help me!

Volitive- Mi volas ke vi helpu min.- I want you to help me.

Helpon is the accusative form of help used as a noun

Mi bezonas vian helpon.- I need your help.

Nephihaha (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 11:42:49 Ngày 11 tháng 1 năm 2015

deltasalmon:Saluton!

I'm new to this forum and new to Esperanto so sorry if this is an obvious question.

My first Esperanto "study guide" was the phrases on this website: http://omniglot.com/language/phrases/esperanto.php

After reading about grammar I was confused about some of the phrases that end in -on which I thought was the accusative noun ending.

Saluton / Helpon / Dankon.

My guess is that these phrases are abbreviated for longer ones like "Mi bezonas helpon" => "Helpon".
Exactly.

English does this occasionally e.g. please for "if it pleases you"; "howdy" for "how do you do"; ta or thanks for "(I) thank you" etc.

sudanglo (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 14:00:16 Ngày 14 tháng 1 năm 2015

Whilst the accusative in such expressions as helpon, bonan matenon, saluton, bonan vojaĝon, sufiĉon!, dankon, pardonon etc is commonly explained in terms of a truncation of a longer sentence, it is not possible to say what that sentence is - only to suggest plausible candidates.

On the other hand, a universal term to describe this function of the accusative marker is difficult to find. The accusative of declaration?

If I were in a cinema and saw smoke, then, in the extremely unlikely event that all the patrons were Esperantists, I would be tempted to call out Fajron! (not Fajro).

On the other hand I think I would say Bona ideo! (not bonan ideon) on hearing a suggestion I liked. Yet playing a game with children in the car on a long drive, I would expect one of them to call out Flavan Aŭton! Mi gajnis.

I suppose that what the accusative is doing here is indicating that the idea is in some way complete in itself, whereas a nominative would open up the idea of further qualification.

In general, all the various uses of the accusative add meaning, and direct attention to the topic in a different way.

Rugxdoma (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 12:19:19 Ngày 15 tháng 1 năm 2015

sudanglo:I suppose that what the accusative is doing here is indicating that the idea is in some way complete in itself, whereas a nominative would open up the idea of further qualification.
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